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This is a really frustrating list at times. I’m going to let loose on it, but let me be clear that this comment is directed at the list, and not Eddie, and not the author of this article. I very much appreciate Eddie sharing this list so we can discuss it, and I appreciate the author writing this list, because I think this list is very accurate and reflects a lot of the reasons people have for not attending church.With that said…1) Folks in this position do not have strong faith as the parenthetical at the end states.2) Sorry to hear obeying Jesus and being in community with the family of God isn’t enough.3) Then why don’t you take what you have learned and invest it into others, you selfish and unfaithful servant?4) See #2.5) Understandable, but at worst this is a reason to find another church, not stop going to church.6) Understandable, but at worst this is a reason to find another church, not stop going to church.7) Understandable, but at worst this is a reason to find another church, not stop going to church.8) Understandable, but good luck finding anywhere on earth where this doesn’t happen. If conflict is unresolved because of leadership weaknesses, then at worst this is a reason to find another church…9) Understandable, but at worst this is a reason to find another church…10) Very understandable, but at worst this is a reason to find another church…11) Very understandable, but at worst this is a reason to find another church…12) Very understandable, but at worst this is a reason to find another church…13) Understandable, but at worst this is a reason to find another church…14) Understandable, but it’s still not any excuse for disobeying God’s command to assemble together. What can this person do to help make a mediocre nearby church into a good one?
The ole timer didn’t even click on the list or read it.
I ran out of peanut butter.This is one response to an individual who had not attended church in some time.When asked why he quit coming he said, I ran out of peanut butter.Then he explained, One excuse is as good as another if you have no excuse.He eventually did come on occasions________________God-HonoringChrist-CenteredBible-BasedSpirit-Led
Why I can identify with the man who ran out of peanut butter–
Attending church is not the same as being the church. I think the point of the article is to examine how a local church might be structured and governed in ways that can discourage true believers from wanting to assemble there.It’s one thing to want to stop attending church and another to not want to assemble with other believers. I think there are truly some people who WANT to assemble with other believers who have become very frustrated with the way church is done.
12 years ago, I have encountered a significant number of individuals who are in transition. They would like to become a part of a local fellowship but have been turned off to church for some very legitimate reasons. I know these people and they are mature, sincere believers who are honestly looking for something more than what they were/are receiving.I’m not stressing more as in selfish interests, but who find there quest rebuffed by local leadership, who find local leadership resisting their desire for deeper, fuller spiritual encounter and service.I’m sure I’ll be rebuffed for this thought: Local leadership (at least in my experiences) are following something other than a Biblical model for the Church and the call to Discipleship… and modeling Scriptural leadership.So, there it is – fire away________________God-HonoringChrist-CenteredBible-BasedSpirit-Led
A more well-defined title, Tom, would be:
Over the years I have known preachers who, for some reason, ‘FELT OBLIGATED TO ATTACK’a member from the pulpit, most of the time ‘anonymous’ and most of the time petty.I have always thought it was very poor judgement. So yeah, I like the I ran out of Peanut Butter excuse.Boy would that make a good ‘whipping boy’ from the leadership(?)________________Some facts but mostly just my [email protected]/
Cojak, as much as you travel, you an momma Cojak can stop at any ole convenience store a pick up a jar a peanut butter. At excuse aint gonna work fer you, son.
There are valid reasons for folks to ‘stop attending YOUR church’.I am not sure if this is the place, but I witnessed this in two churches I attended. I am not a confrontational person. When a pastor states in no uncertain words at a council meeting, It’s my way or the highway, it’s time for me to go, I did.I used as an excuse ‘That the other church was closer to our new house. It was absolutely true, but not the reason.The pastor who was a great preacher, lost 20 leading tithe paying members. Most had been in that church for 40+ years. They were solid citizens, members and Godly people.If your worship time is normally 150 -200 attendees and in 4 months you have 50 attending, you had better pay attention to some ‘excuses’. Not everyone was like me, just leave. Some tried to reason with the pastor with no avail.When someone stops attending ‘your’ church, is not the time to cut the guy down. Calling the non attending members names and listing their excuses from the pulpit as non-Christian, ‘Ain’t Good’________________Some facts but mostly just my [email protected]/
A more well-defined title, Tom, would be:
I still don’t see how the peanut butter fits in here, Cojak?
I agree with those statements where DAve says Understandable,
Thanks for posting this Eddie although I wish you wouldn’t have picked a day where I am trying to focus all of my available time praying for and about our Saturday service tonight! My heart has been grieved in a big way about the sad spiritual condition I see in the American church today and I have been collecting thoughts and waiting until I have the time to post a thread about it here. I read these articles from church growth people, consultants and other pastors who want to explain why people are leaving church, falling away from God etc. However, during the last several years I quit reading their books and going to their seminars. I prefer to spend that available time and those financial resources praying and leading others into joining my wife and I in prayer, Bible studies and reaching out to individuals for their salvation and spiritual growth. Please do not feel I am condemning anybody who is into their teachings because I spent years checking it out and this is where God has me now (and hopefully forever because I enjoy the basics of filling up and giving out to the unsaved, discipling leaders etc.).I appreciate the short free versions posted here because unless God tells me to do otherwise I will probably not again allocate my time to the growth books, seminars, consultants etc. I really do appreciate the dialogue with those who are seeker sensitive, emergent, missional or whatever term you prefer to use for your way of doing church, helping with the journey etc. Please know I am trying to say this so as not to provoke an argument. I enjoy feed back from those who disagree with my theological beliefs and/or philosophies of ministry because I want to stay open to whatever God wants to show me with His Word as my standard.The writer of these steps may be a well intentioned consultant but I see many church consultants and well meaning pastors of mega churches as part of the problem. Weight loss people can sell desperate overweight people their diet answer. Church consultants and leaders can likewise market church growth methods to hurting pastors or those who,sincerely are looking to,reach people for Christ. We all know that a large Sunday morning attendance is what most use as standard for a successful church. I really believe people are leaving church for other reasons. We know people are desperately hurting all around us and Jesus is the great spiritual, emotional and physical healer. If His presence was strong among believers who,assemble together (along with the seekers of course) people would,want to be there. I would like to suggest two basics that I will follow up on when I have more time.1. I believe people are leaving because so much more time is spent by some well meaning pastors and church growth consultants following natural methods rather than truly praying together for God’s direction and presence. How much time does one spend reading books, teaching from books, hours in coaching-seminars as compared to pastorsand leaders praying together? Man can design exciting dynamic worship, relevant messages, entertaining cool music message productions that entail excitement that mimics the convicting presence of the Holy Spirit. As licensed clinical and Christian counselor I have studied extensively on crowd psychology, manipulative leadership styles etc. Often trendy methods create excitement among people who have never spent 1 hour let alone hours experienced the presence of a HOLY God among people who have repented from sin and unselfishly pray together. I capitalized HOLY but please refrain from calling me legalistic or out of it because I still believe my God is a holy God who expects that from us His children. Therefore, many people leave cause they never experiences the Jesus that makes us want to pray daily, read our Bible daily, give of our finances to see His work go forward. Instead of a daily priority to read the Bible and pray these poor people go on watching 10-40 hours of sports, TV ‘ social media etc. a week and then look to the Sunday service as their spiritual time. Man, I am not fulfilled! Maybe God had more grace when you first accepted Christ but He expects more out of you now.2. America is overloaded with teaching about salvation and people being told they are saved and part of the family of without being taught and led to repentance. Therefore, it is a false Christianity with a bad foundation from the start if we go the way of believing that a person can be saved without repentance to sin and God’s gift of grace. Matthew 16Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.Ironically my text tonight is Hebrews 5:7to 6 Therefore leaving the principles of the doctrine of Christ, let us go on unto perfection; not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works, and of faith toward God,2 Of the doctrine of baptisms, and of laying on of hands, and of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.Notice the repentance from dead works and faith toward God are called basic principles of doctrine in relation to going on towards perfection.I do know quality people who are taking a break because they were closely knit to many bad church situations with unethical leaders. As a counselor I have met with people in secular clinical and Christian counseling sessions who suffered legitimate spiritual, emotional and/or physical abuse. I also know some Godly people. I also know good people who are taking a break because after giving so much time and money to churches they were continually burned by pastors who spent lots of money and then left for a better opportunity when the bills came but the people/givers didn’t show up.
Dave Dorsey Wrote: 15) Possibly the only valid reason on the entire list, although I would encourage someone that in a time of stress and crisis, a strong church family is one of the best respites. If someone is going through crisis and is a part of a church that magnifies their burdens rather than helping to share and reduce them, they should probably not attend — but they should try to be diligent in finding a church that will stand with them through their trial.Before I comment, can somebody pm me or post how to quote somebody and put it in one of those nice boxes? I tried to figure it out to no avail and lest I be exalted above measure I need to lean on others for computer help.
Putting it in a pretty little box
Hey, Doc, if you want to quote the whole kit and caboodle, just look on the lower right side of a person’s post (under his or her avatar). You will see a little square that says quote. Just click on that and it should bring up a dialogue window with the person’s post already in a quote box. Then just add your own comments above or below (like I did here). If you only want to quote a portion of what a person says, just copy and paste, then bracket it: Copy what the person said; click on a reply on the thread to open up your dialogue box; paste the quote in the dialogue box; left click to highlight the quote, then, while the quote is highlighted, look right above your dialogue box at the little row of tools and select the box that says Quote. If any of that needs clarifying, let me know, and I will try to clear it up for you later today.