I was watching one of my favorite Star Trek movie and Spock turns to Kirk and says, Have we lived so long that we have outlived our usefulness?I didn’t hear much from the rest of the movie. The very question reverberated throughout my heart. I began to consider ministry and where I am. I examined the ministry of many large churches and honestly, it just isn’t me.Please don’t crucify an old minister. I’m just pouring out my heart. I’m not attacking or criticizing any church or ministry. I’m just doing some soul searching.I visit other churches and I see things that I just can’t get into. Young people getting up in front and dancing, drama teams, etc. I know people enjoy it and I’m sure it gets kids involved, but honestly, to me it looks like a show of flesh. Our platforms are multicolored light shows with some even with smoke machines. When the speaker makes a point, the color change is quite orchestrated. I recognize smooth Madison Avenue presentation, but deep inside, I can’t stand it.Our music has come to the point where we often leave the worship to the professionals and the atmosphere is more like a concert than a worship service. I endeavor to learn the words to songs I don’t know, try to sing in keys best suited for someone who hasn’t gone through puberty, raise my hand and praise God while feeling totally out of place.I read church growth books, publications, and articles. They list tool after tool such as these that just leave me cold.I realize now that I’m part of a huge section of the ministry of the Church of God.Have we lived so long that we’ve outlived our usefulness?Just musing. Please don’t stone me for just sharing my musings________________
Rough , I know exactly how you feel. I went through the very same. I found that peace in a smaller church where worship service is more what I’m used to with no lights or drama Just simple worship.It has its drawbacks to that I have learned to overlook. Very poor music team , simple pastor and few kids. But then I realized , I’m not here for my entertainment but for worship , learning and teaching. God put me here for a reason and thats good enough for me. I dont know if the Drama churches are right or not but I do know that they can trap and cause some people to lose focus on your objective. It happened to me.
I posted this a couple of weeks ago – it’s even worse than you think
Roughrider,
Rough, I am 53 and have seriously considered retiring from pastoral work for all the reasons you posted. I know that may sound extreme, but the reality is that the pressure to perform in a way that is not me…It feels like I am between a rock and a hard place. I feel like I need to get out of the way and let someone who can grow a rural church have the rein.
I had a feeling that I wasn’t the only one who felt this________________
Could you stand a little texas swing on amazing grace ?
I guess I could say I have ‘no dog in this fight’, but I would be lying. There are so many wonderful ministers, some even great, who are pastoring ‘the church that will not grow’. They are blessed with the satisfaction of God’s hand that has guided their lives over the years. But then something whispers in their ear, Bro XYZ is doing ‘zzxty’ and everyone is praising him to high heavens. Then Bro. Goodguy begins to feel like he has out-lived his usefulness. BALONEY! Look around at the people who depend on you, respect and call you friend and pastor. If it is 10 or 1000 when you are doing what is right and honorable, YOU ARE USEFUL.I remember a guy who once told me about a small church in Florida that should be closed. The preacher is ancient and the congregation is too. Since I knew the situation I told him, The church will never grow, they have closed the Citrus plants, the jobs are gone, but someone needs to comfort and bury the saints who labored, taught, won souls and blessed their world when it was GOING. That pastor has not outlived is usefulness.Now to us who sit on the pew, we too feel at times that we have outlived our usefulness. We cannot work, our tithes are half what they were. We cannot see to drive to church at night and if we want to, can feel completely useless.This post is a VERY IMPORTANT post. I was only in service with RR one time, but I knew without a shadow of a doubt those folks love him. Rough, you will never know how many times I have related that morning (SS class?) in the basement, as you led a sort of round table discussion. I have never set-in a more inspiring morning.We have too many good men who fall into the trap of listening to the voice on shoulder urging comparisons……..Love you guys who give your heart and lives for us who sit in the pews and we may forget to say, Thank you for being YOU! but we do think it. ________________Some facts but mostly just my [email protected]/
Good word!
No, you haven’t outlived your usefulness, Rough.This is why we have so many different churches in so many different places. Like ice cream, we used to just have strawberry, vanilla, and chocolate. Now we have Rocky Road, Snickers, birthday cake flavors and the list goes on and on…Different strokes for different folks. Not everyone is into the hype and glitz. And because you’re doing it differently doesn’t mean it’s wrong or not hip enough. My sister has not truly walked with the Lord in many years. She grew up (in the same church as me) that was classic Pentecostal. She likes churches that sing from the Red Back and use live music. The church I attend is pretty old school in a lot of ways, but we also use a blend of contemporary praise/worship, Southern Gospel, and black gospel as well as hymns. And we don’t have a band so we use sound tracks. My church would never appeal to my sister. But that doesn’t mean what we’re doing is wrong. It’s what works for us. And it blesses our people.The style of worship and ministry that you are comfortable with relates to who you are as a person and who you are in Christ. The people who come to your church enjoy those things too, or they wouldn’t be there. If your worship and ministry is sincere and touches the heart of God, don’t worry about what the big churches or other churches are doing. Please the Father and everything else will fall into place________________More of Him…less of me.twitter.com/camiracle77www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=691241499&ref=name
Rough, first don’t be so rough on yourself!I’ve had the pleasure of attending several large churches while living in different areas of the country. Believe me, they aren’t all they are cooked up to be. I do NOT get the obsession with having a mega Church. A mega Church is Ok if it is done through real growth and not merely transfers from other congregations. Even then, after the conversion, I seriously doubt the ability of mega churches to truly minister other than the mass spectacle manner in which it is now. Theoritically, I guess they could function OK, but I have never seen it work, unless the goal is impressive light shows, professional singers, slick productions, etc. The issue to bloom where you are planted. Ministers can be far more effective pastoring a small church if they are truly ministering to the needs of the congregation. Growth by transfers is an illusion. The kingdom as a whole has not grown. If pastors would spend more time on their knees and by fasting, they can be much further ahead than by reading the latest and greatest fad from a text or by attending a church growth seminar. A real move of God will result in growth, either spiritually by the members or by conversions of the lost.I have earned the well earned reputation of being the world’s worst fisherman. I once bought a book on fishing and my neighbor from Montana had a huge laugh. He said, the problem is the fish don’t read those books! The problem with the latest Church growth buzzword and reading the latest Church growth book is that (1) God doesn’t read those books and (2) sinners don’t read those books. When Jesus cast out the demon’s, he didn’t say it came about by reading the latest book or attending the best seminar, he said this comes forth by prayer and fasting (I know I misquoted somewhat). I’m not a preacher, but I am the son and brother of pastors. Although a layperson, I probably know far more about church processes than most laypersons. Unfortanately, I may know more about Church growth than some pastors. Although not a pastor, I have ministered through nursing home music minstery and as a small group leader. The Church small group that I led grew from 4to almost 40 in one year and we had to divide it. The pastor said my wife and I were the best small group leaders he had ever known. The secret? We made people feel welcome and loved. My proudest moment came when the husband of a member who refused to go to church started going to our meetings after we held it in his home and he was eventually saved. While this is certainly different than actually pastoring, some concepts apply. My problem with mega churches is it is almost impossible to maintain a personal touch and people get lost in the crowd. If cell groups were truly functioning, I guess it could work. Don’t be discouraged by not being a mega Church pastor. I don’t think God is going to ask if your church grew to be a mega church, rather, did you do your best where you were planted. If we all acted the same, there would be no need for McDonalds, Wendy’s, Five guys, etc as we would all like the same thing. Not all Churches need to be large. I have no idea on God’s purpose of creating Mosquito’s, but somehow he saw a purpose to create it with the millons of other creatures. He knew it all worked together in his infinite wisdom. There is a need for the small Church that ministers to people in need. Somehow, I doubt there were mega churches in the first century and yet they revolutionized the world.
Please read my response to rough. Growth is not necessarily with numbers!
Amen!
I really don’t know how to respond to the OP. Rough you and I have laughed over many things, but your post struck my heart. I am 64, have Pastored over 40 years. I was at my last church for 15 years. I was then struck down with old brain injuries, and have been disabled since 2009. Due to the fact that my ministry ended so unexpectenty I have truly been grieving the end of it, however, as I watch Churches I don’t know if I could Pastor today. So many things have changed over the years. When I was in Bible College we all learned how to do flannel graphs. Now it’s all computer generated high quality production. I was birthed into a Pentecostal Church whose greater goal was to get someone to come to repentance, and be filled with the Holy Spirit. My grandfather told my Dad in 1939 that the day was coming when the Cross would no longer thrill the soul. I think we have reached that stage. After my disability and retirement I decided to return to the organization with which I was Ordained following BC and Seminary, the A/G. I like the local A/G pastor, and I feel like I am home. Nothing against the COG, I just feel more at home. It’s my roots! I am a New Englander after all.Rough I fully understand your frustrations. Are we an anacranism, or are we relevant. I don’t speak for anyone but myself. My day has passed. Love everybody on this board and appreciate each of you!Harold BeesleyFormerly 38008________________
I really don’t know how to respond to the OP. Rough you and I have laughed over many things, but your post struck my heart. I am 64, have Pastored over 40 years. I was at my last church for 15 years. I was then struck down with old brain injuries, and have been disabled since 2009. Due to the fact that my ministry ended so unexpectenty I have truly been grieving the end of it, however, as I watch Churches I don’t know if I could Pastor today. So many things have changed over the years. When I was in Bible College we all learned how to do flannel graphs. Now it’s all computer generated high quality production. I was birthed into a Pentecostal Church whose greater goal was to get someone to come to repentance, and be filled with the Holy Spirit. My grandfather told my Dad in 1939 that the day was coming when the Cross would no longer thrill the soul. I think we have reached that stage. After my disability and retirement I decided to return to the organization with which I was Ordained following BC and Seminary, the A/G. I like the local A/G pastor, and I feel like I am home. Nothing against the COG, I just feel more at home. It’s my roots! I am a New Englander after all.Rough I fully understand your frustrations. Are we an anacranism, or are we relevant. I don’t speak for anyone but myself. My day has passed. Love everybody on this board and appreciate each of you!Harold BeesleyFormerly 38008________________
..and personally, I think most of these ideas for growing churches is a bunch of hoooey. I think half of the people writing them think because it worked for them it should work for everyone else and that’s simply not the case. Too many variables in pastoring churches. There is a place for the larger churches but I have to say, I believe there is more of a place for the small town community church. The larger churches are pulling people away from their communities leaving a void that lead people to find something else(drugs, alcohol, etc). Several communities in my area don’t have strong churches because everyone is driving 15 to 20 miles to the big church. It’s funny how people miss these small churches. They take comfort in the old hymns and the prayers of Sis/bro old saint who know how to reach heaven. These are the churches and pastors that neighborhood people can get to in a hurry. These are the churches and pastors who lend a helping hand, perform the wedding for free, show up at the ER at 3am, bring food to the family in need…… I could go on. Not saying the bigger churches don’t do that but more needs are met when these churches are in neighborhoods.
I’m encouraged to see a young person who sees the light that big churches isn’t meant for everyone. There seems to be a sense that everyone must have a lightshow, impressive multi media displays, the best rock band, etc. We are not all the same. Bigger churches should not be the goal. Worshipping Jesus, leading others to Him, and being there for the people that need you should be the goal.
Methocostal said I was young