The System that we created will never let loose of it’s power. This system is so self serving and power hungry that such a change Would threaten that power. Honestly if the council of 18 has no more power than the state councils do it would make no real difference. Giving honest Council to the man that holds your job in his hands is not power it is a joke.
Ouch so much conflict of interest… the deck is stacked against pastorsSo how do we fix this Should we do like the ag and creat regions stating x number must come for western states x number come from midwest X number from the south east northeast exc. checks and balences need to occur.How would we fix this list Tony D. Stewart, pastor, CityLife Church, Tampa, Fla.- pastor Kip A. Box, regional overseer, Northwest Region-official Ishmael Prince Charles, Field Director, Caribbean, Tortola, British Virgin Islands- officialMitchell E. Corder Jr., state overseer, Tennessee-officialGerald E. McGinnis, pastor, Knoxville, Tennessee- too close to Cleveland G. Dennis McGuire, international revivalist, Cleveland, Tenn.officalNick Park, pastor, Drogheda, Ireland- pastorEliezar Bonilla, pastor, San Antonio, Texas- pastorTimothy Wayne Oldfield, pastor, Columbus, Ohio- pastorKeith L. Ivester, state overseer, Tampa, Florida- officialGary J. Lewis, state overseer, South Georgia- official H. Loran Livingston, pastor, Charlotte, North Carolina- pastor strongest voiceSean Stewart O’Neal, state overseer, Arizona- officialJimmy D. Smith, Cleveland, Tennessee- OfficalSamuel Santana, state overseer, Southwestern Hispanic- officialKevin McGlamery, pastor, Huntsville, Alabama- north Cleveland youth pastorTravis C. Johnson, pastor, Homestead, Florida- pastorBarry Clardy, pastor, Hamilton, Ohio- pastorJaparlin Marbun, National Overseer of Indonesia- officialStafford Petersen, secretary general Full Gospel Church of God South Africa- official 11 officials to 7 pastors we are out numberedThe 7 pastors on this list only 1 has a strong enough voice to buck the system and that is Loran Livingston everyone else is either pastor who is Cleveland bound or a politically green i.e. Easily controlled by the system of overseerers and officials
It seems to me seeing the men mentioned that are on the Council of 18, that it not only represents system people, but also people who have maturity in the Lord and a lot of wisdom. What you seem to have is a total disrespect for the system and any authority. This is not going to serve you well in the COG or any denomination, for that matter. IMHO, the best thing you could do to help yourself is to study authority and its place in the kingdom of God & His work. Once you have a Biblical model in place for what might work, work through the system to change it________________More of Him…less of me.twitter.com/camiracle77www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=691241499&ref=name
I really like this particular Council of 18. They are not at all like you are portraying them to be. We cry for younger and then bash them after we elect them citing inexperience. That’s just stupid. And there are strong- very strong leaders who obey God over men on that list and you act like they are just interested in pleasing men and not in making righteous decisions. I like them – I like them a lot. I disagree with the entire premise of this post and I suppose it’s made by somebody not on that list who has sour grapes over not being appointed to something. I’m not appointed to anything except my local church to pastor right now and I say that we have fine men on our Council of 18 that really want what’s best for the Kingdom of God. I plan on voting for each of them that is eligible to continue at the next General Assembly – which won’t be in Cleveland’s back yard. I can’t believe you even criticized that. Sour grapes. I suppose the final answer in your mind is to put you and people like you on the Council of 18. I pay my tithes right and only got 2 votes to go on – that was probably wise of the Ordained Bishops too
The COG is no different than our Federal Government. It is all hot garbage. The system is set up to for everyone to aspire to be at Cleveland and to make $$$$. It will take some time, but the COG will eventually dwindle down to an organization of old saints that reminisce about the glory days of the church.I have essentially seen this in the COGOP, that I grew up in. I have been COG my entire adult life and the very same mentality is what I see within the politics of the COG________________
All Pastor Council of 18 dream team Tony Stewart city life Mark Williams north Cleveland Loran Livingston central churchSam Luke victory tab Marty baker Stevens creek Kevin Harris Cooper City Eliezar Bonilla abundant lifeSteven lowery national cogDavid fox lighthouse tabWilliam Lee Daytona deliverance David smith family worship center Pueblo mmBen Prescott- Free Chapel Orange County Niko Njotorahardjo- Bethany IndonesiaNick park pastor Ireland Doug Anderson Rose Heights Joe dobbins twin riversTony Scott church on strayer David Cooper Mount paranThen we make state council appoint and decide state overseers
[quote=21stcenturyministry]All Pastor Council of 18 dream team Tony Stewart city life Mark Williams north Cleveland Loran Livingston central churchSam Luke victory tab Marty baker Stevens creek Kevin Harris Cooper City Eliezar Bonilla abundant lifeSteven lowery national cogDavid fox lighthouse tabWilliam Lee Daytona deliverance David smith family worship center Pueblo mmBen Prescott- Free Chapel Orange County Niko Njotorahardjo- Bethany IndonesiaNick park pastor Ireland Doug Anderson Rose Heights Joe dobbins twin riversTony Scott church on strayer David Cooper Mount paran
I have tremendous respect for authority and leadership. Having said that, I spend very little time worrying about who is serving on any particular council, board, or committee. I have never been asked to serve on an international level, but I can tell you from serving on the state level at various stages and positions, it can be a thankless job. If I’m never nominated for another board or committee position again, I would be perfectly fine with that. I encourage those who have a desire to serve in that capacity. At this phase in my life and ministry, I feel my efforts are best spent in my community. I am an advocate for less administrative pork. I do like the model of having pastors serving at the highest levels. It seems to work effectively for the Southern Baptists. But then again, they are autonomous, which brings us back to the initial conundrum that centralized government presents. I better stop. I’m starting to sound like Bro. SheepDog
I honor and respect leadership but I have totally lost respect for The way leadership is done in our denomination. We have lost our Way. We have become system focused and not harvest focused. Pastors almost become prisoners in a centralized from of government. You either learn to deal with it or you lose everything. Our leaders serve the system because the system serves them well. You can’t fix leadership issues because in our denomination our leadership holds all the power and local pastors only know who to vote for because they are promoted by our system. Extremely few of people that get into Denominational leadership will nwwever pastor a local again.
The greater authority I Respect Authority as well. But with that being said, their is always a greater authority. That authority is God. We must have absolute respect for the authority of God. If we sat on our laurels as Christians and just accepted authority as it is we wouldn’t have the reformation with Martin Luther and his 95 theses. Even Jesus stood up to the Sanhedrin. If it wasn’t biblical to question authority Would Jesus have been able to stand up to the Sanhedrin the Pharisees or the Sadducees. Jesus is the greatest authority we must recognize that. Certainly us as a church of God wouldn’t have made it out of the hills of East Tennessee and western North Carolina if we obeyed the authority of the area baptist churches and the KKK when we began. There comes a point to where we have to ask ourselves scripturally are we lording it over people as the Bible condemns Matthew 20:25-26
The System that we created will never let loose of it’s power. This system is so self serving and power hungry that such a change Would threaten that power. Honestly if the council of 18 has no more power than the state councils do it would make no real difference. Giving honest Council to the man that holds your job in his hands is not power it is a joke.
Ouch so much conflict of interest… the deck is stacked against pastorsSo how do we fix this Should we do like the ag and creat regions stating x number must come for western states x number come from midwest X number from the south east northeast exc. checks and balences need to occur.How would we fix this list Tony D. Stewart, pastor, CityLife Church, Tampa, Fla.- pastor Kip A. Box, regional overseer, Northwest Region-official Ishmael Prince Charles, Field Director, Caribbean, Tortola, British Virgin Islands- officialMitchell E. Corder Jr., state overseer, Tennessee-officialGerald E. McGinnis, pastor, Knoxville, Tennessee- too close to Cleveland G. Dennis McGuire, international revivalist, Cleveland, Tenn.officalNick Park, pastor, Drogheda, Ireland- pastorEliezar Bonilla, pastor, San Antonio, Texas- pastorTimothy Wayne Oldfield, pastor, Columbus, Ohio- pastorKeith L. Ivester, state overseer, Tampa, Florida- officialGary J. Lewis, state overseer, South Georgia- official H. Loran Livingston, pastor, Charlotte, North Carolina- pastor strongest voiceSean Stewart O’Neal, state overseer, Arizona- officialJimmy D. Smith, Cleveland, Tennessee- OfficalSamuel Santana, state overseer, Southwestern Hispanic- officialKevin McGlamery, pastor, Huntsville, Alabama- north Cleveland youth pastorTravis C. Johnson, pastor, Homestead, Florida- pastorBarry Clardy, pastor, Hamilton, Ohio- pastorJaparlin Marbun, National Overseer of Indonesia- officialStafford Petersen, secretary general Full Gospel Church of God South Africa- official 11 officials to 7 pastors we are out numberedThe 7 pastors on this list only 1 has a strong enough voice to buck the system and that is Loran Livingston everyone else is either pastor who is Cleveland bound or a politically green i.e. Easily controlled by the system of overseerers and officials
It seems to me seeing the men mentioned that are on the Council of 18, that it not only represents system people, but also people who have maturity in the Lord and a lot of wisdom. What you seem to have is a total disrespect for the system and any authority. This is not going to serve you well in the COG or any denomination, for that matter. IMHO, the best thing you could do to help yourself is to study authority and its place in the kingdom of God & His work. Once you have a Biblical model in place for what might work, work through the system to change it________________More of Him…less of me.twitter.com/camiracle77www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=691241499&ref=name
I really like this particular Council of 18. They are not at all like you are portraying them to be. We cry for younger and then bash them after we elect them citing inexperience. That’s just stupid. And there are strong- very strong leaders who obey God over men on that list and you act like they are just interested in pleasing men and not in making righteous decisions. I like them – I like them a lot. I disagree with the entire premise of this post and I suppose it’s made by somebody not on that list who has sour grapes over not being appointed to something. I’m not appointed to anything except my local church to pastor right now and I say that we have fine men on our Council of 18 that really want what’s best for the Kingdom of God. I plan on voting for each of them that is eligible to continue at the next General Assembly – which won’t be in Cleveland’s back yard. I can’t believe you even criticized that. Sour grapes. I suppose the final answer in your mind is to put you and people like you on the Council of 18. I pay my tithes right and only got 2 votes to go on – that was probably wise of the Ordained Bishops too
The COG is no different than our Federal Government. It is all hot garbage. The system is set up to for everyone to aspire to be at Cleveland and to make $$$$. It will take some time, but the COG will eventually dwindle down to an organization of old saints that reminisce about the glory days of the church.I have essentially seen this in the COGOP, that I grew up in. I have been COG my entire adult life and the very same mentality is what I see within the politics of the COG________________
All Pastor Council of 18 dream team Tony Stewart city life Mark Williams north Cleveland Loran Livingston central churchSam Luke victory tab Marty baker Stevens creek Kevin Harris Cooper City Eliezar Bonilla abundant lifeSteven lowery national cogDavid fox lighthouse tabWilliam Lee Daytona deliverance David smith family worship center Pueblo mmBen Prescott- Free Chapel Orange County Niko Njotorahardjo- Bethany IndonesiaNick park pastor Ireland Doug Anderson Rose Heights Joe dobbins twin riversTony Scott church on strayer David Cooper Mount paranThen we make state council appoint and decide state overseers
[quote=21stcenturyministry]All Pastor Council of 18 dream team Tony Stewart city life Mark Williams north Cleveland Loran Livingston central churchSam Luke victory tab Marty baker Stevens creek Kevin Harris Cooper City Eliezar Bonilla abundant lifeSteven lowery national cogDavid fox lighthouse tabWilliam Lee Daytona deliverance David smith family worship center Pueblo mmBen Prescott- Free Chapel Orange County Niko Njotorahardjo- Bethany IndonesiaNick park pastor Ireland Doug Anderson Rose Heights Joe dobbins twin riversTony Scott church on strayer David Cooper Mount paran
I have tremendous respect for authority and leadership. Having said that, I spend very little time worrying about who is serving on any particular council, board, or committee. I have never been asked to serve on an international level, but I can tell you from serving on the state level at various stages and positions, it can be a thankless job. If I’m never nominated for another board or committee position again, I would be perfectly fine with that. I encourage those who have a desire to serve in that capacity. At this phase in my life and ministry, I feel my efforts are best spent in my community. I am an advocate for less administrative pork. I do like the model of having pastors serving at the highest levels. It seems to work effectively for the Southern Baptists. But then again, they are autonomous, which brings us back to the initial conundrum that centralized government presents. I better stop. I’m starting to sound like Bro. SheepDog
Respecting leadership
I honor and respect leadership but I have totally lost respect for The way leadership is done in our denomination. We have lost our Way. We have become system focused and not harvest focused. Pastors almost become prisoners in a centralized from of government. You either learn to deal with it or you lose everything. Our leaders serve the system because the system serves them well. You can’t fix leadership issues because in our denomination our leadership holds all the power and local pastors only know who to vote for because they are promoted by our system. Extremely few of people that get into Denominational leadership will nwwever pastor a local again.
The greater authority I Respect Authority as well. But with that being said, their is always a greater authority. That authority is God. We must have absolute respect for the authority of God. If we sat on our laurels as Christians and just accepted authority as it is we wouldn’t have the reformation with Martin Luther and his 95 theses. Even Jesus stood up to the Sanhedrin. If it wasn’t biblical to question authority Would Jesus have been able to stand up to the Sanhedrin the Pharisees or the Sadducees. Jesus is the greatest authority we must recognize that. Certainly us as a church of God wouldn’t have made it out of the hills of East Tennessee and western North Carolina if we obeyed the authority of the area baptist churches and the KKK when we began. There comes a point to where we have to ask ourselves scripturally are we lording it over people as the Bible condemns Matthew 20:25-26
Re: Not going to happen
Do you know Travis Johnson or Tony Stewart personally?