Found this..www.patheos.com/blogs/christiancrier/2015/07/26/top-7-bible-verses-about-gods-omnipresence/ These verses certainly can be taken to show omnipresent, but they can also go against it. Yes, God has information no everything…but is He everywhere at once…that is the scripture I cannot find. Aaron,
Found this..www.patheos.com/blogs/christiancrier/2015/07/26/top-7-bible-verses-about-gods-omnipresence/ These verses certainly can be taken to show omnipresent, but they can also go against it. Yes, God has information no everything…but is He everywhere at once…that is the scripture I cannot find. Aaron,Do you believe that God created time, space and matter? Tom,Yes, as a matter of faith and belief. Can I explain WHERE God was before He created Space? Can I explain WHAT God was doing before time (which involves change)? No, I can’t. (Matter could be argued to be non-spiritual, and thus it could be held that God, being non-matter, could create matter.) But do note that my argument is not against omnipresence, but is rather questioning whether we have solid scripture to back that, as opposed to it simply being, Anselm-like, an abstract exercise that says, It is better to be everywhere than just in one place, therefore, since God is better than anything, He must be omnipresent.
“If anyone worships the beast . . . he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever†(Revelation 14:9–11)Other verses (such as 2 Thessalonians 1:9) reference this being away from the presence of the Lord but taken together it is not clear that the eternal separation of unbelievers is a separation in the sense that it would imperil our notion of God’s omnipresence.
Anselm’s argument was that God was the highest conception we could have. And so, since existence is higher than non-existence, God must exist. Lots of issues with that, but still.Consider that we have declared God omnipresent NOT because it is stated in scripture, but because omnipresence is higher than presence.I’m not saying that God isn’t omnipresent. I’m simply arguing that I have not been able to clearly find it in scripture.Consider that the devil shows up wherever you go. I could go to Mars. Do I suppose the Tempter might be there and be up to no good? Of course. Omnipresent? No.Lastly, I’m not sure it logically MUST be the case that God is omnipresent if He created time and space (see my earlier concerns on this). Yes, I think God IS omnipresent, but so far, I am not sure that I have scripture or reason to lend support.
Aaron,There are many things that are clearly and properly inferred from Scripture rightly divided, while not overtly stated themselves. It is unwise IMO to be cautious about these things on the basis that they are not overtly stated in Scripture.When considering the attributes of God, theologians have traditionally broken them into two categories, communicable and incommunicable. The former being attributes He shares with His creation, the latter being attributes He does not.There are two non-communicable attributes that are clearly founded in Scripture, and clearly establish God’s omnipresence. Those attributes are God’s transcendence and His immanence.You should be able to find information about these and their strong underlying Scriptural support in most any systematic theology. I personally would recommend Michael Horton’s The Christian Faith as an excellent introduction on this topic. A.W. Tozer’s book The Attributes of God is a great one as well.
“If anyone worships the beast . . . he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever†(Revelation 14:9–11)Other verses (such as 2 Thessalonians 1:9) reference this being away from the presence of the Lord but taken together it is not clear that the eternal separation of unbelievers is a separation in the sense that it would imperil our notion of God’s omnipresence.If one subscribes to annihilationism then this is certainly a separation, but it is a separation as a result of the non-existence of the unbeliever. This also does not challenge our notion of God’s omnipresence.
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Re: Are y’all trying to say that God IS omnipresent?
Found this..www.patheos.com/blogs/christiancrier/2015/07/26/top-7-bible-verses-about-gods-omnipresence/
Eddie…
Found this..www.patheos.com/blogs/christiancrier/2015/07/26/top-7-bible-verses-about-gods-omnipresence/
Found this..www.patheos.com/blogs/christiancrier/2015/07/26/top-7-bible-verses-about-gods-omnipresence/ These verses certainly can be taken to show omnipresent, but they can also go against it. Yes, God has information no everything…but is He everywhere at once…that is the scripture I cannot find. Aaron,
Found this..www.patheos.com/blogs/christiancrier/2015/07/26/top-7-bible-verses-about-gods-omnipresence/ These verses certainly can be taken to show omnipresent, but they can also go against it. Yes, God has information no everything…but is He everywhere at once…that is the scripture I cannot find. Aaron,Do you believe that God created time, space and matter? Tom,Yes, as a matter of faith and belief. Can I explain WHERE God was before He created Space? Can I explain WHAT God was doing before time (which involves change)? No, I can’t. (Matter could be argued to be non-spiritual, and thus it could be held that God, being non-matter, could create matter.) But do note that my argument is not against omnipresence, but is rather questioning whether we have solid scripture to back that, as opposed to it simply being, Anselm-like, an abstract exercise that says, It is better to be everywhere than just in one place, therefore, since God is better than anything, He must be omnipresent.
Aaron,
“If anyone worships the beast . . . he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever†(Revelation 14:9–11)Other verses (such as 2 Thessalonians 1:9) reference this being away from the presence of the Lord but taken together it is not clear that the eternal separation of unbelievers is a separation in the sense that it would imperil our notion of God’s omnipresence.
Anselm’s argument was that God was the highest conception we could have. And so, since existence is higher than non-existence, God must exist. Lots of issues with that, but still.Consider that we have declared God omnipresent NOT because it is stated in scripture, but because omnipresence is higher than presence.I’m not saying that God isn’t omnipresent. I’m simply arguing that I have not been able to clearly find it in scripture.Consider that the devil shows up wherever you go. I could go to Mars. Do I suppose the Tempter might be there and be up to no good? Of course. Omnipresent? No.Lastly, I’m not sure it logically MUST be the case that God is omnipresent if He created time and space (see my earlier concerns on this). Yes, I think God IS omnipresent, but so far, I am not sure that I have scripture or reason to lend support.
Aaron,There are many things that are clearly and properly inferred from Scripture rightly divided, while not overtly stated themselves. It is unwise IMO to be cautious about these things on the basis that they are not overtly stated in Scripture.When considering the attributes of God, theologians have traditionally broken them into two categories, communicable and incommunicable. The former being attributes He shares with His creation, the latter being attributes He does not.There are two non-communicable attributes that are clearly founded in Scripture, and clearly establish God’s omnipresence. Those attributes are God’s transcendence and His immanence.You should be able to find information about these and their strong underlying Scriptural support in most any systematic theology. I personally would recommend Michael Horton’s The Christian Faith as an excellent introduction on this topic. A.W. Tozer’s book The Attributes of God is a great one as well.
You are correct.
“If anyone worships the beast . . . he will be tormented with fire and sulfur in the presence of the holy angels and in the presence of the Lamb. And the smoke of their torment goes up forever and ever†(Revelation 14:9–11)Other verses (such as 2 Thessalonians 1:9) reference this being away from the presence of the Lord but taken together it is not clear that the eternal separation of unbelievers is a separation in the sense that it would imperil our notion of God’s omnipresence.If one subscribes to annihilationism then this is certainly a separation, but it is a separation as a result of the non-existence of the unbeliever. This also does not challenge our notion of God’s omnipresence.