I thought this was a really interesting article: ftc.co/resource-library/blog-entries/was-george-whitefield-a-christianI think there are a lot of folks in our tribe who could (and should) walk through the same questions and thoughts about MLK and his legacy, both his good and his seemingly unrepentant sin.
Whitefield was wise enough to see that slavery was not going to end in his lifetime. And like most people of his day who opposed slavery, he favored gradual emancipation. Thus, he saw no conflict in taking the approach of meeting slaves right where they were at, in slavery. By working within the system, he demonstrated how a Christian slave owner should treat his slaves. His example was key in bringing about a more paternalistic approach to the system in North America. To those in the church who would now seek to throw Whitfield under the bus, I say that none of them could hold a candle to the man’s life and ministry. If we could find anywhere is Apostolic writing where slavery in condemned and Christian slaveholders are commanded to free their slaves, then I’d be the first to question Whitfield. But no such admonitions were given by the Apostles. Thus, attacks on Whitfield are no more justified than attacks on Jefferson. Dave, none of my comments here are addressed towards you. I realize you are simply opening a discussion. Interestingly, I studied this topic in-depth in one of my graduate courses________________
Was George Whitefield a Christian?
I think George Whitefield was no more of a Christian than Martin Luther King. Where each ended up after their sinning is only a good guess.When we look back on David’s life the only difference between him and the above mentioned was his repentant heart.The white evangelical whitewashing now not only looks back in history to whitewash but they whitewash in the present.
Using this line of reasoning we could ask the question of Paul based on the scriptures belowWas Paul saved?1 Corinthians 7:20At a certain time, God chose to speak to you so that you came to Christ. So, each of you should continue as you were then.21 You may have been a slave when God spoke to you. That does not matter. But you may have the chance to become a free person. If you do, then use it.22 Sometimes the *Lord chooses a slave to belong to him. Then, that slave becomes the *Lord’s free person. In the same way, when a free person comes to Christ, he becomes Christ’s slave.23 God has bought you and he has paid the price for you. So, do not let anyone else make you their slave.24 My friends, who are like brothers to me, each one of you should live for God. He put you where you were. Then he spoke to you. So, each of you should continue as you were then.
It’s clear that my previous statements to you about avoiding personal attacks are not being heard. Please accept this post as your
I apologize for being too personal
Re: Was George Whitefield a Christian?
The article references the verse in Exodus 21, which I personally think is a lot more applicable to American chattel slavery than verses in Ephesians, etc. The Bible does not say it is a sin to own a slave, but it does identify manstealing as a cruel and wicked sin in both the OT and the NT (Romans 1
It’s clear you don’t see it as an attack. I’m trying to let you know, as someone who is working in good faith to keep you on this forum, that it was a personal attack and your approach needs to change if you want to keep posting here.
Re: Was George Whitefield a Christian?
The article references the verse in Exodus 21, which I personally think is a lot more applicable to American chattel slavery than verses in Ephesians, etc. The Bible does not say it is a sin to own a slave, but it does identify manstealing as a cruel and wicked sin in both the OT and the NT (Romans 1, etc.) The USA did not man steal. Slaves were taken by various means by warring tribes in Africa. They were waiting at the docks to be sold to customers from the Colonies and for a brief time, the USA________________
Re: Was George Whitefield a Christian?
For 89 years, not counting the time prior to 1776. That’s not brief.
And not to put too fine a point on it, but:Whoever steals a man and sells him,
For 89 years, not counting the time prior to 1776. That’s not brief.But while you’re right that the US did not capture African slaves, is there any moral difference between purchasing stolen people and stealing them yourself? They went to these markets and saw men bound in chains, which they then purchased and forced to work. Is the fact that they were one step removed from the manstealing enough to exonerate them of culpability before God? Dave, the brief time remark was concerning the USA as an entity. By 1808 no more slaves were being imported to this country. As for the rest of your comment, slavery in America was just as immoral as it was in the Roman Empire during Apostolic times. Yet, the Apostles did not accuse Christian slave owners of sinning for owning slaves, nor demand that they liberate their slaves. My biggest concern is this move in the church to exalt ourselves as being morally superior than those who did own slaves. And that means
Did Paul quote that to Christian slave owners in the Roman Empire? No. It did not apply to Gentiles in the first place. Furthermore, 90% of the slaves ever owned in America had not been snatched. They were born into slavery________________
God’s law applies to all people across all time. It is where God graciously reveals His character and tells us all we need to do to be righteous before Him, even though not one of us could do it. Manstealing and all those who engaged in it participated in grievous wickedness, which under the Law would have resulted in death. Under grace, it can result in forgiveness even for these most wretched of sinners. Which brings us full circle back to Wilson’s article and the judgment of the law and the mercy of grace.Paul condemned manstealing in 1 Timothy 1, which of course is a letter written to a Gentile to help him give instruction to other Gentiles. The fact that he did not condemn it in Ephesians is sufficient evidence that he was talking about a different form of servitude that was not like American chattel slavery. That is to say, kidnapping and selling someone (or buying, holding captive, and forcing someone thus captured to work) is obviously not the same as the bondservice that Paul is discussing in Ephesians 6
God’s law applies to all people across all time. It is where God graciously reveals His character and tells us all we need to do to be righteous before Him, even though not one of us could do it. Manstealing and all those who engaged in it participated in grievous wickedness, which under the Law would have resulted in death. Under grace, it can result in forgiveness even for these most wretched of sinners. Which brings us full circle back to Wilson’s article and the judgment of the law and the mercy of grace.Paul condemned manstealing in 1 Timothy 1, which of course is a letter written to a Gentile to help him give instruction to other Gentiles. The fact that he did not condemn it in Ephesians is sufficient evidence that he was talking about a different form of servitude that was not like American chattel slavery. That is to say, kidnapping and selling someone (or buying, holding captive, and forcing someone thus captured to work) is obviously not the same as the bondservice that Paul is discussing in Ephesians 6, unless Paul is contradicting himself in the two epistles. Are Gentiles commanded not to wear linen and wool together? And again, 90% of American slaves were born into slavery. But the point is, we are going a dangerous route when we begin to denounce people like Whitfield________________
No, but they are commanded in 1 Timothy 1:10not to participate in slave trading.