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Personally, NO I do not. but that doesn’t mean I am right. But that is still my opinion. I always thought it was weird having demons of tobacco and sex, that plagued people. When that trend started it bothered me, still does. THANKS for mentioning it. ________________Some facts but mostly just my [email protected]/

I’m trying to think of all of the passages that could be stretched to try to teach this stuff.The most obvious — perhaps because of Jentezen Franklin’s sermon on the topic — is the spirit of python in Acts 16:16. Of course the Bible never says anything about a spirit of python, it calls it a spirit of divination. But the Greek word for divination is pythōna which is where this teaching comes from. Of course, sound exegesis and teaching reveals that Paul is using this word to associate the spirit with region of Pytho and more specifically the oracle of Delphi.Associating this spirit with demonic oracle-like activity makes sense in light of what the slave girl in Acts 16was doing. Franklin’s twisting of this passage to make this spirit one that squeezes the life, joy, and goodness out of believers is especially unbiblical in this context.—The other that jumps to mind is the reference to Jezebel in Revelation 2:20. Clearly there are some similarities between this woman in the Thyatiran church and Ahab’s wife, so it makes sense that the writer (and the Lord!) would use the reference. But again, sound exegesis seems to clearly indicate that Christ is referring to a specific, living individual in the church, rather than a demon who is animating or inspiring one or more individuals.This seems evident based on Christ’s description of having given her time to repent, and His promise to judge and punish her for not having done so (v. 21-23). It’s possible that ‘Jezebel’ here is literally her name, but it’s hard to imagine anyone naming their daughter Jezebel. The language here also calls to mind John’s reference to the elect lady in 2 John 1, which could suggest the reference here is to a group of false prophetesses that were encouraging sexual immorality in the church.Either way, the passage is talking about people and the works of their flesh, not a demon named Jezebel.—

Since Jesus said that that woman Jezebel taught the people to fornicate and to eat meat offered to idols, that might be the similarity with the ancient Jezebel. Those were aspects of Canaanite religion. Revelation 2does not mention her controlling her husband or killing prophets. And there is no reference to her being a ‘spirit.’It kind of reminds me of Lilith, a woman from a legend about Adam’s first wife before Eve who was rejected because she wanted to be on top. Later Lilith was thought to be an evil spirit that killed babies________________

Do we suppose that the Bible tells us EVERYTHING about demons? No. But it does tell us all we NEED to know (namely, that they have to go in the Name of Jesus, etc.). For instance, wouldn’t you like to know more about why the demons wanted to go into the swine? What we have is mainly conjecture.Wouldn’t you like to know where demons come from? Some say they are fallen angels, etc. But to the best of my knowledge, that it nothing but conjecture, too.However, when someone speaks of a Jezebel spirit, I do not take this to be a particular DEMON, but rather a set of behaviors that can enable us to be more watchful with people exhibiting those behaviors. Just as the FBI has profilers that can tell us the traits of certain serial killers (believe it or not, cruelty to animals, bed-wetting, and fire starting are three things that show up in many or most serial killer profiles!), we would be foolish to ignore behaviors that often reveal darker things.The same with the Jezebel spirit. Like I said, I have never considered that a particular demon, but rather someone who is acting in a way that we believe Jezebel acted. Just as we can see people that are controlling, or insecure, or narcissistic–and can divine from that certain elements that we would be wise to regard in the future with other people/situations–so, too, can we see both negative and positive traits in Biblical characters and draw some conclusions.For instance, do you recall how Jesus told the disciples (who wanted to call down fire from heaven) that they didn’t know what spirit they were of? He is letting them know that they were acting in a manner that was contrary to the pattern/spirit they should have been following.Now, sometimes, it does indeed get weird. And perhaps this is something that can only be detected by discernment, but, yeah, sometimes people go to some wild places in their teaching, and in such cases, we must take care. I tend to take many things with a grain of salt, not giving exceptional weight to it until I can better study it or confirm it, etc.Most of us preach sermons that are based on these principles. For instance, we may not call it the spirit of Esau, we might very well preach a sermon about people who trade their birthright for some bauble, relatively speaking. Demas? I think we could EASILY come up with a spirit of Demas. But I think the use of the word spirit can get problematic, making people think it is a specific spirit with a specific name, rather than a profile that often accompanies people who turn back to the world.In our mid-week Bible Study, going through the stories of the Bible, we spoke of Jezebel. And I simply pointed out some key things that Jezebel exhibited and warned against such things. I might have used the term Jezebel spirit, but I think it was clear that I meant actions associated very strongly with Jezebel.

Seems to me that the biblical recipe for deliverance is the same in every single instance, regardless of any type or classification the demon may have, and regardless of how few or many there may be. One’s closeness to God may be relevant to the exercise of one’s faith in this matter, if Matthew 17:21is authentic (there are textual issues with this verse).But otherwise… do I want to seek information outside the Bible about demons and the spirit world, step away from my one authoritative source for verifying information as true, and open myself to whatever spiritual entity wants to try to tell me something?

Re: Some thoughts…

Dave, Right. It’s not NECESSARY. But it can be helpful. Consider that something alerted Paul to the fact that the woman had a spirit of divination, EVEN THOUGH SHE WAS TALKING THEM UP! Do you not suppose it would behoove us to try to understand why it took him a while to figure out the matter? Don’t you suppose that it would be best to nip it in the bud, rather than let it run free for a few days (positioning itself as having been the first to discern that Paul was from God)?Yes, everything we NEED spiritually is in the Bible. But do you suppose that is ALL that God has to say about a matter? Do you think God has been silent for 2000 years, not giving us any additional insight? What FOOLS we must be if, after 2000 years, we don’t know anything more than what the Early Church knew.If we evolved as the CHURCH OF GOD, then it stands to reason that we also evolved as part of the universal CHURCH. I’m not saying you have to accept python or Jezebel. You may not–especially if you find it contrary to the Bible. But to act like there is nothing else USEFUL to us (even if not NECESSARY) seems wrongheaded. Why? Because explaining and delving into the Word is precisely what ministers do! If they didn’t, women would be keeping silence in the churches, right? Ministers take a verse, delve into it, pray about it, and open up insights that we didn’t have before. While I’m sure there is plenty of foolishness that goes on, it seems that something similar is happening when people teach on the Jezebel spirit: They are peeling back the layers and trying to expose a certain sort of controlling influence.

Sorry dude, that does not seem like a good idea at all.It’s one thing to talk about additional study on natural or scientific matters.It is another entirely to suggest we go beyond the boundaries of the Word on spiritual things, particularly concerning malevolent entities that are seeking to deceive us and destroy our souls.I am not looking to learn anything about demons that the Bible does not reveal. In the name of Jesus, come out. That is all any of us needs to or should know. But Dave, as I indicated, I do not particularly think that there is a Jezebel DEMON. I think that by Jezebel spirit, what we really mean–or at least what I’ve seen reflected in real life–is a set of attitudes, behaviors, etc. I don’t believe there is so much a spirit to CAST OUT as there is behaviors to be aware of, to guard against, etc. It may be that an actual demonic spirit is behind it, but I sure want to be aware of how it can play out in the church. Let me give you an example….Many years ago, there was a man who came to our church in Tampa. He would apparently go on mission trips to Central America, etc., and he seemed to be a very genial type of person. But I kept noticing that every time he sang or testified…it seemed out of order in some way. In one case, my dad had to get him to NOT tell the punchline to a particular joke he wanted to tell before singing. It wasn’t dirty, but it was utterly carnal.In time, the man got sick. I would visit him on occasion. When he died, his wife didn’t seem all that sorrowful. I later learned that his trips to Central America were to visit his mistress.I felt like the Lord revealed to me–and it has been shown to be the truth in every instance since then–that when someone who should be a mature Christian is consistently out of order…they are leading a double life.Now, that is nowhere in the Bible. And yet I know it to be true. Don’t you think that might be valuable information? And as for what’s in the Bible is all that’s needed, well, yes. It can stand alone. But it can also be enhanced by knowing that there is MORE that God has revealed. I believe the closing of the canon was a manmade construct. It IS the Word of God…but why in the world would we think God had nothing further to say?

Well, yes, it’s dangerous. But that should never keep us from greater truth from God. As far as the non-Pentecostal churches are concerned, speaking in tongues and prophesying is dangerous, as these claim to be messages from God (which is precisely what the Bible is!).Further, there is ZERO REASON OR SCRIPTURE to think that God is NOT revealing new things? Why in the world would you think that? No, He’s not revealing anything that is contrary to what He has already revealed, but why would we think He is not revealing new things? In 2000 years God hasn’t had ANYTHING new to say to mankind?